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Another round of short logs

Zor

Found it May 16 by  [Censored] (123 found)

?

Found it May 1 by [Censored] (123 found)

tfth

Found it May 14 by [Censored (123 found)

TFTC

 

Do you sense a pattern forming here?

Short logs have come up in discussion on here previously, and have even been discussed once or twice in the podcasts. It’s something that seems to be a bit of a volatile subject amongst some of the cache owners. After having received about 20 of these on my Story Teller series recently, I decided to actually do something about it.

I started with a thread on the official geocaching forums about whether or not owners are allowed to delete logs. I am going to expect some serious kickback from users on there since they typically fight about everything. But what I am trying to find out is whether or not an owner has the right to delete a log because they feel it is not within the owner’s guidelines for logging. At first I wanted to delete all of their logs because I was pretty peeved. But as time has passed a bit, I think I’ve mellowed and am just more annoyed than anything.

The reality of the situation is that the “short log” is becoming more and more popular and after having put out a considerable amount of caches, I don’t think it’s overly difficult for someone to at least write a single line of text as their log. Even if it’s copied and pasted 100 times, that’s fine. At least you took the time to write out something. But with so many people just writing TFTC or 🙂 or whatever, to me, that shows a complete and total lack of respect to the cache owners.

Look at something like Hillbilly Bob’s caches on the Dobson. That guy spent a LOT of time hiking out there and hiding caches for people to enjoy. Now we have this awesome trail of caches all the way to Fundy. Does it seem right to post “TFTC” for every one of those caches? How does that show appreciation for all his hard work?

Or how about Tetagoucher’s Catamount Trail series? Or Viking’s Trail of the Gods series? Would you do all of those caches and then just say TFTC as your thanks? The finder would have spent HOURS doing those trails and caches but they can’t find the time to write out a couple of sentences to use to share their experiences? How does that seem right?

In my case, the latest batch of these came from a REALLY new cacher who only started a few weeks ago so I emailed them, welcomed them to the game, and gave them a heads up on the short log issue as they logged all their caches with a single character. I never did receive a reply from them so I will assume that they either ignored the email, or simply read it and chose not to reply.

What I, and some others, tend to believe is that the gaining popularity of this logging pattern has to do with mobile field notes and logging on the fly. Many folks are now using smartphones to geocache and therefore, they end up actually logging their finds on the road. It’s much easier to type “TFTC” on a smartphone than a long, or at least mildly verbose log.

The other interesting fact about this is that the CEO of Groundspeak, Jeremy Irish, has actually said that he now fully endorses the “empty” log. That’s a log on a find that actually has nothing in it. He himself has said that the act of logging a find is enough to say “I found it” and that a comment/real log is not necessary.

To me, I find that that a bit disturbing and completely disrespectful to those of us who spend a lot of time putting out a good chunk of caches to others. I mean, is it that hard to write out even a copy and pasted log?

What’s your take on this popular trend?

avatar

Zor

I am Zor. The creator of protoculture. Otherwise known as a geeky father of two, husband to an awesome wife, and a hardcore geek.

35 thoughts on “Another round of short logs”

  • I think you’re being a little overly sensitive in this issue. As more people combine paperless caching with long cache runs and I expect you’ll see more of the short logs versus less. Logging from the field is pretty cool and efficient (if you’re in cell range), logging from home forces you to try to remember tidbits of all 40 caches that you did? That’s a tough call. I equate this issue with the copy/paste of exact same text for 40 logs on a cache. But as a reason for deleting logs? Absolutely not.

    • Ya, after I settled down from my irritation, I felt the same way about deleting. I’m not opposed to field notes because I use those on my Oregon a lot, and I know that it’s near impossible to remember something about each cache. But for me, I’d rather have a copy and paste log for 40 caches, than 40 cache logs that say TFTC. That’s just my take on it.

      When I use field notes, I use them to let me know which caches I have found/dnf and then for ones that I want to remember, I make a quick little note to refresh my memory when I log them online.

      If short logging is to become the “norm” for caching, I might just end up turning off all notifications. I don’t think it’s a betterment of the sport at all.

  • I’ve had several days of over 100 finds and still almost always manage to put a quick, unique note in my logs. I know it can a couple of hours to do the logging, but the reality is that it takes the cache owner a lot longer to get the cache and contents, find a spot, hide it, take the reading, do the write up and submit the cache. I can take 60-120 seconds out of my life to say at least a little something to the CO. If I’m going to be doing a lot of caches, I take the time to write them down and add a little info about the find, etc.

    I wouldn’t delete a crappy log on my caches (and lord knows, I see a lot of them), but I understand the desire to do so.

  • Not to sound like an old timer, but I remember when longer logs that told a good story were pretty much the norm. And I had to walk uphill both ways to the cache…

  • I guess it depends on where you are with the sport. In my case I don’t have $400+ GPSr to log field notes but then again I don’t do any more than 30 caches at once ever. That’s because caching to me at this point in my life is simply one of my hobbies, add to that two somewhat active young kids and it gets me this: after being out for 4 hours caching the last thing I want to do is sit and write notes for another hour. Right now since I don’t do many at once I can in fact remember to write pertinent logs but in the future, well we’ll see. I like caching but I also like cycling, golf, summer hockey, doing stuff with the kids etc. I’ve written the odd TFTC but they are very rare.

  • I’m on the fence on this subject now a new part of this subject, a new cache in Fredericton contains nothing on the cache page but the coords a name and some attributes no short description, long description or any hint at least they took the time to add attributes but really how hard is it to add a couple words on the cache description?

    • Yea I saw that. I still don’t know if it’s on purpose or if the CO just didn’t bother to add anything because they are new and are unfamiliar with the listing a cache page. Whereas a short log may be one of hundreds of logs the empty cache listing is there foreever.

    • I was going to make an old engine starting sound effect as I like sound effects, but I cannot write properly just plane words, so little would I know how to spell phoneticallly.

  • Our “Prevaricator’s Pleasure”, clearly states on a laminated paper that this is not an ordinary cache and that the log MUST contain a lie, it does not have to be long or detailed. On Dec. 12 it was logged with “tftc”. We didn’t delete it but, certainly thought of it.
    When we do a series of caches I often write a log thanking the CO for all the work and maybe tell of a few adventures we had along the way. I then mention that the rest of the series will be logged with a short log, unless it was special or something spectacular happened.

  • As a much newer member (Less than 300 finds) than all of you guys/gals, I hope my opinion reflects that of the “under 1000” crowd. I enjoy creating caches as much as finding them. I enjoy the comments about my caches, as well as the appreciation. Yes, just the fact that someone got in their car to find my cache should be thanx enough, but yeah, a simple few words are considerate.
    Remember, the size of the log matters.

    Blank logs on power runs are different.

  • My take on it is if they have nothing to say about it they must not have appreciated the cache and or it’s location… As such I find it hard to get motivated to hide any more. Also, It’s always nice to know the condition of the cache. When I get a TFTC I assume that it is in good condition but thats not always the case. You would think that at the very least they would put ” Thanks For The Cache” LOL!

    However, maybe we should say what we would like to see in a log to give ideas to those who may not think we care. I normally say very little because I don’t think anyone want’s to know the who what when where why but I on the other hand enjoy it. I like to know where you started the journey when and how long it took you. Also who you were with and how much trouble you got into. As well the condition of the cache and your opinion on if you like the container and location and if there was anything else you could add…

  • If I do a bunch from the same owner sometimes I stretch out a story from log to log so they want to read them all to see what I had to say. Sometimes some of the middle logs may only have 1 sentence or not make sense but the owner should get it.

      • I recommend it, it is fun and makes logging from my phone easier as the logs can be short and the story long at the same time.

        • I can attest to this. Rev did that with the 100+ logs he did on my Story Teller series and those were some of the bets/funniest logs I ever read. Him and paulandstacey did the same thing and it was awesome.

  • I was reading some similar thread on GC.com (beside Zor’s there like another 2 or 3). I gather that the vast majority are annoyed by the empty log or the ”TFTC” log. Here is a quote that I loved: “There are great COs who can make a P&G interesting, there are bad COs who could make a mountaintop boring.
    There are great loggers who will turn an LPC into a novel, there are bad loggers who could find a winning lottery ticket on the ground at the GZ and will post TFTC”
    🙂

  • Although I’m often just goofing around, and voice a skewed opinion just to cause reaction in others… here is my real take on this…
    I hide caches for others. I hide them so that they can receive the same enjoyment from geocaching that others have given me. As such, I place no requirements or demands on their enjoyment of the game. If they want to type in a 1000 word log, great. If they want to type TFTC, fine. If they just want to tell me to piss off, that’s OK too. I don’t place caches for my own glory or satisfaction. Take from them what you will, I ask nothing in return.

  • When you spend just a little time telling the owner how you feel about a series, you sometimes get this kind of email

    HI : I am really glad you enjoyed doing the BvPP series and other caches I`ve put out here on the `gentle isle`. I enjoyed getting this group out as I think it`s a really nice area and I like the thought of people going in there and having a good time. thanks a LOT for your kind comments and all the best of luck for the rest of this trip. I hope we`ll see you again ( met you at your `ice walk`event back in winter ) either here or back in your home area.
    best regards.. Bob aka Olewaif

    • Those are just fine….lol, there is more than one word. Maybe there should be a “jerk” button as well, but we would call it the Zonker button. 🙂

  • There has been a lot of discussion about this lately in the shoutbox.

    I am a little disappointed when I get a short log but I dont get upset about it.

    It seems to be mainly from cachers who are not part of the main group of cachers who know each other well from events and/or online discusssions, etc. I dont know the motivation for the logs but I have to think that the short logs are not out of meanness but perhaps because of uncertainty with writing skills, or shyness, or family or work commitments.

    I am certain that like all of us they are getting enjoyment out of this great hobby and perhaps it is a needed escape. I will not say anything that will dampen that enjoyment.

    • Again,you are correct, I need to let this go but I really like reading the logs and I get upset when it seems like they don’t care. I feel like they are using us and don’t care to give back but like you said maybe there is a reason for it. But it is all 3 of them and they cache together and I feel like they just want to do their own thing and not interact with the rest of us. I made an attempt to explain my thoughts in a cache to be polite but either they choose to ingnore it or just saw a cache on their GPS and found it without reading the listing. I guess everyone can’t be as chatty as you, Nemo, Paulandstacey or me. Then again maybe that is a good thing.

  • The hell with Saint Paul, Saint Peter is way better, or shall I say St-Pierre 🙂
    Talking about which, do you know where this saying is coming from? Rob Peter to pay Paul, or in French: Déshabiller St-Pierre pour habiller St-Paul.

    It has to do with two Cathedral in London, the St-Paul Cathedral and the Westminster Abbey (which is in fact St-Peter’s Church).

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